Comments on: The Bible: Verses and Chapters and Why They Don’t Do Justice http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th the home of Nathan Colquhoun Sat, 11 Feb 2012 06:45:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: John http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-406 John Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-406 Wow, I just typed in comment number 7 on your previous blog Nathan and referenced how the Pharisees used Scripture to miss Christ, and here you are drawing out that point in the next blog I read.<br /> <br /> I guess that means I agree.<br /> :) Wow, I just typed in comment number 7 on your previous blog Nathan and referenced how the Pharisees used Scripture to miss Christ, and here you are drawing out that point in the next blog I read.

I guess that means I agree.
:)

]]> By: Aaron http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-407 Aaron Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-407 good discussion around a lot of these issues guys. i'm glad to see you wrestling through this to find the truth. keep pursuing truth in everything and God will continue to reveal Himself to you through it.<br /> <br /> i have a lot of scattered thoughts on the subject and i'm a talker, not a typer so i'll just keep it brief.<br /> <br /> i think the main thing way we have missed the point with the Bible is that we have reduced it to nothing more than a book-- a Christian manual or guideline that we use to live a better life or support our humanistic beliefs. and while on many levels it can be used for "teaching, rebuking, and training in righteousness", i believe we are selling ourselves short if we are reading it exclusively as such. bottom line: the Bible is a Person to be known, not a texbook. the minute we reduce the Bible to nothing more than the value of its words and paragraphs we have sold ourselves short and completely missed the point.<br /> <br /> there is definitely a danger in viewing verses, paragraphs, and even books without seeing them in light of the entire Book... after all, Scripture historically has been used to support genocide, racism, and numerous other things that would make our stomachs turn.<br /> <br /> may we pursue the Person first and use the Book as a tool to do so-- not as an end to itself. good discussion around a lot of these issues guys. i’m glad to see you wrestling through this to find the truth. keep pursuing truth in everything and God will continue to reveal Himself to you through it.

i have a lot of scattered thoughts on the subject and i’m a talker, not a typer so i’ll just keep it brief.

i think the main thing way we have missed the point with the Bible is that we have reduced it to nothing more than a book– a Christian manual or guideline that we use to live a better life or support our humanistic beliefs. and while on many levels it can be used for “teaching, rebuking, and training in righteousness”, i believe we are selling ourselves short if we are reading it exclusively as such. bottom line: the Bible is a Person to be known, not a texbook. the minute we reduce the Bible to nothing more than the value of its words and paragraphs we have sold ourselves short and completely missed the point.

there is definitely a danger in viewing verses, paragraphs, and even books without seeing them in light of the entire Book… after all, Scripture historically has been used to support genocide, racism, and numerous other things that would make our stomachs turn.

may we pursue the Person first and use the Book as a tool to do so– not as an end to itself.

]]> By: Ollie http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-408 Ollie Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-408 I agree in one sense that the Bible is to be taken as a whole story, but I also think that it is unavoidable to use parts (verses) of the Bible to understand how to live our life or to support our understanding of who God is and to tell others about it. I think that we have to use Scripture to back up the things we say/believe (often times by reference to specific verses - see Jesus as He is tempted in Matt 4). Otherwise, how can we be held accountable? It doesn't work to say "I read the whole Bible and got the feeling that God wants us to use it a whole (or 66 books), and not reference specific verses" without actually referencing verses to support your point of view. <br /> <br /> It seems to me that this is what you did, Nathan, in referencing John 5:39-40. I know that you said to take it in context but that is still using a part (section) of the Bible. I do believe, however, that using specific verses must be done with extreme caution and, as you said, that the context should always be referenced or understood. This caution should be doubled when someone else is giving us guidance based on verses here and there. <br /> <br /> Please forgive me if I misunderstood your point, especially so if I'm focusing on one or two of your sentences to the exclusion of what your main point was.<br /> <br /> Respectfully,<br /> Ollie I agree in one sense that the Bible is to be taken as a whole story, but I also think that it is unavoidable to use parts (verses) of the Bible to understand how to live our life or to support our understanding of who God is and to tell others about it. I think that we have to use Scripture to back up the things we say/believe (often times by reference to specific verses – see Jesus as He is tempted in Matt 4). Otherwise, how can we be held accountable? It doesn’t work to say “I read the whole Bible and got the feeling that God wants us to use it a whole (or 66 books), and not reference specific verses” without actually referencing verses to support your point of view.

It seems to me that this is what you did, Nathan, in referencing John 5:39-40. I know that you said to take it in context but that is still using a part (section) of the Bible. I do believe, however, that using specific verses must be done with extreme caution and, as you said, that the context should always be referenced or understood. This caution should be doubled when someone else is giving us guidance based on verses here and there.

Please forgive me if I misunderstood your point, especially so if I’m focusing on one or two of your sentences to the exclusion of what your main point was.

Respectfully,
Ollie

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-409 Anonymous Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-409 John, Aaron, Ollie; thanks for your comments.<br /> <br /> Ollie, in response to yours I just want to say that I didn't mean that we couldn't or shouldn't quote verses to support our claims (as I did this in the exact post, like you pointed out, and I did in the post also by saying 'yes two verses' because I suspected that might be pointed out.<br /> <br /> Obviously Christ, Paul and the discples all used Scripture to back their claims. My point wasn't to abolish that practice. I was hoping to show how in general we have lost the concept as the bible being a whole, and have reduced it to ONLY parts. The only way those parts make sense is in the context of the entire bible, we can't pick and choose verses from everywhere to support or claims, when the point of the bible may have nothing to do with that at all?<br /> <br /> How many different contexts can "I know the plans i have for you, plans to prosper....etc" Jer 29:11 be used? If we read it in context though, we know that God is talking to Jeremiah about something specific, maybe the nation of Israel, maybe Jeremiah specifically, to be honest i don't know. But is it really a verse that we can use to encourage someone whose wife left him? Read out loud in front of a church to support financial prosperity. Encourage high school students that God has a plan for their lives in regards to their careers and so on. Not that they shouldn't be encouraged, however reading the verse takes it out of context and just applies 'authority' to claims that make us feel good (even if they are truthful claims). I'd much rather support my claims by verses in context of the entire message.<br /> <br /> So you are correct, verses by themselves have their place and they are not wrong in themselves as i have stated, but i think we need to push hard as the church to be continually lining ourselves up not with invidividual verses but the entire message of Christ.<br /> <br /> Thanks Ollie, i really do appreciate your comments, i apologize for not being clear on that, but thanks for bringing it up. John, Aaron, Ollie; thanks for your comments.

Ollie, in response to yours I just want to say that I didn’t mean that we couldn’t or shouldn’t quote verses to support our claims (as I did this in the exact post, like you pointed out, and I did in the post also by saying ‘yes two verses’ because I suspected that might be pointed out.

Obviously Christ, Paul and the discples all used Scripture to back their claims. My point wasn’t to abolish that practice. I was hoping to show how in general we have lost the concept as the bible being a whole, and have reduced it to ONLY parts. The only way those parts make sense is in the context of the entire bible, we can’t pick and choose verses from everywhere to support or claims, when the point of the bible may have nothing to do with that at all?

How many different contexts can “I know the plans i have for you, plans to prosper….etc” Jer 29:11 be used? If we read it in context though, we know that God is talking to Jeremiah about something specific, maybe the nation of Israel, maybe Jeremiah specifically, to be honest i don’t know. But is it really a verse that we can use to encourage someone whose wife left him? Read out loud in front of a church to support financial prosperity. Encourage high school students that God has a plan for their lives in regards to their careers and so on. Not that they shouldn’t be encouraged, however reading the verse takes it out of context and just applies ‘authority’ to claims that make us feel good (even if they are truthful claims). I’d much rather support my claims by verses in context of the entire message.

So you are correct, verses by themselves have their place and they are not wrong in themselves as i have stated, but i think we need to push hard as the church to be continually lining ourselves up not with invidividual verses but the entire message of Christ.

Thanks Ollie, i really do appreciate your comments, i apologize for not being clear on that, but thanks for bringing it up.

]]> By: leonard kee http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-925 leonard kee Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-925 wow dude<br /> nice facts wow dude
nice facts

]]> By: Pastor Keith http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-1234 Pastor Keith Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1234 Hi,<br /> Interesting discussion! I too agree that the Bible has been prostituted for financial and personal reasons. The scriptures are good for reproof and edification. I have heard many sermons preached that take so many scriptures out of context! We must as leaders see to whom the verse was speaking, what was going on at that time, and what the message was within the text. The scripture says that we should only use words that lift and edify those around us. Nowhere in the Bible did Jesus ridicule or put down anyone! God is the judge, not us, so we should lead people with encouragement and example. I do not believe that we should take a few scriptures to justify our own convictions. If God tells you to leave it alone, then do it. Do not try to mold every situation to fit those convictions. Let God be God and that is it! God Bless All! Amen. Hi,
Interesting discussion! I too agree that the Bible has been prostituted for financial and personal reasons. The scriptures are good for reproof and edification. I have heard many sermons preached that take so many scriptures out of context! We must as leaders see to whom the verse was speaking, what was going on at that time, and what the message was within the text. The scripture says that we should only use words that lift and edify those around us. Nowhere in the Bible did Jesus ridicule or put down anyone! God is the judge, not us, so we should lead people with encouragement and example. I do not believe that we should take a few scriptures to justify our own convictions. If God tells you to leave it alone, then do it. Do not try to mold every situation to fit those convictions. Let God be God and that is it! God Bless All! Amen.

]]> By: K. H. Jones http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-1452 K. H. Jones Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1452 There is a compiled copy of the Holy Scriptures that has had the chapter and verse divisions placed in the left margin.<br /> I, too, beleive the artificial divisions have done at least as much harm as good.<br /> The website www.kathosgrapho.com has a sample of the text and other information. There is a compiled copy of the Holy Scriptures that has had the chapter and verse divisions placed in the left margin.
I, too, beleive the artificial divisions have done at least as much harm as good.
The website http://www.kathosgrapho.com has a sample of the text and other information.

]]> By: Pastor Keith http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-1545 Pastor Keith Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-1545 This discussion has grown very nicely. As I see others commenting on the verses and chapters, I am reminded of how the Bible is an example of the "Living Word" and we can all benefit in different ways. God can speak to us from the scriptures and deal with issues in our lives based on a single verse. I have had many that hit me between the eyes and opened my heart more to the Lord. The love in these blogs is not even in the least offensive or stabbing at one another. That shows the Christ like character that we as Christians should always carry. <br /> I say keep reading, pray and also study. There are many who miss this very aspect of God's Word! I am absolutely thrilled to read the responses and opinions. Everyone has made excellent points! Thanks! <br /> May God Bless All! This discussion has grown very nicely. As I see others commenting on the verses and chapters, I am reminded of how the Bible is an example of the “Living Word” and we can all benefit in different ways. God can speak to us from the scriptures and deal with issues in our lives based on a single verse. I have had many that hit me between the eyes and opened my heart more to the Lord. The love in these blogs is not even in the least offensive or stabbing at one another. That shows the Christ like character that we as Christians should always carry.
I say keep reading, pray and also study. There are many who miss this very aspect of God’s Word! I am absolutely thrilled to read the responses and opinions. Everyone has made excellent points! Thanks!
May God Bless All!

]]> By: Simon http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/10/25/the-bible-verses-and-chapters-and-why-th#comment-2166 Simon Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-2166 Wow I thought I was the only one who thought that. You hit that nail right on the head. Good Discussion. You only have to watch the God Channels and TBN where this is heavily prominant. Verses are constantly used out of context and a lot of the time its for financial gain. The God channels are no different to the shopping channels, qvc etc... its all money orientated. Selling countless things to people who are struggling but are led to believe that their asking for money to do Gods work and that it will come back to them. I agree give unto the lord and it will come back to you but these ministers on Tv:- Benny Hinn, Juanita Bynum, TD jakes, Paula are just stealing from Gods people as they blindly give money to these ministers so they can buy big private jets and live in luxury and party. Give to a church that has a main focus on worshipping God and following his commandmends, not a church that is purely money orientated. People really need to open their eyes and see whats goin on. Wow I thought I was the only one who thought that. You hit that nail right on the head. Good Discussion. You only have to watch the God Channels and TBN where this is heavily prominant. Verses are constantly used out of context and a lot of the time its for financial gain. The God channels are no different to the shopping channels, qvc etc… its all money orientated. Selling countless things to people who are struggling but are led to believe that their asking for money to do Gods work and that it will come back to them. I agree give unto the lord and it will come back to you but these ministers on Tv:- Benny Hinn, Juanita Bynum, TD jakes, Paula are just stealing from Gods people as they blindly give money to these ministers so they can buy big private jets and live in luxury and party. Give to a church that has a main focus on worshipping God and following his commandmends, not a church that is purely money orientated. People really need to open their eyes and see whats goin on.

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