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	<title>Based on a True Story &#187; Children and Parenting</title>
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		<title>Throwing Out Agendas and Replacing with Mission</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/22/throwing-out-agendas-and-replacing-with-mission</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/22/throwing-out-agendas-and-replacing-with-mission#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2010 04:57:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[In being downtown Sarnia we have always said we never wanted to have an agenda. The idea stemmed from hardcore, door-to-door sales pitches for religious beliefs that we wanted to stay away from. Missionary dating, evangelism surveys, salvation cards, invite your friends to church for a chance to win a stereo Sundays and witnessing in [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2007/02/03/community-mission-entertaining-catch22' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Community and Mission: Catch 22'>Community and Mission: Catch 22</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/03/24/pastors-sunday-production-coordinators' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Pastors: Sunday Production Coordinators'>Pastors: Sunday Production Coordinators</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/05/04/church-a-24-7-response' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Church: A 24/7 Response'>Church: A 24/7 Response</a></li>
</ol>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In being downtown Sarnia we have always said we never wanted to have an agenda.  The idea stemmed from hardcore, door-to-door sales pitches for religious beliefs that we wanted to stay away from.  Missionary dating, evangelism surveys, salvation cards, invite your friends to church for a chance to win a stereo Sundays and witnessing in your cworkplace are all part of the deeply disconnected culture of evangelism that we are reacting against.  When you have to fake a relationship with someone (or why bother even faking at times?) then we thought there must be something wrong.</p>
<p>So in going downtown, to an environment completely unfamiliar to us, one of the things we were going to make sure we did, was erase all agendas.  We had seen the dangers of what agendas could do, so we wanted to steer clear of them.  We were not moving downtown to “save” the downtown.  We were not moving there so we could better understand their culture and then eventually hit them in the head with Bible verses.  We didn’t grab beers with store owners, join the Artwalk committee or go to the concerts so we could get them to come to the events we ran or to church on Sundays.  Our sole purpose was going to be to move somewhere that was abandoned and build relationships with the people that are there with no expectation on them at all.  So that’s what we did.  </p>
<p>We’ve been here for three years now.  I would say we’ve done pretty well at successfully integrating ourselves into the fabric of what is happening downtown.  Besides a few special circumstances, we get along with many of the people downtown and I would call most of them friends.  At this point, any good Christian would see this as a great opportunity to present the gospel as we know it and share it with as many as possible.  The only problem is, it sort of feels that would negate the whole non-agenda clause that we established when we first started.  So we continue to build relationships, and genuinely care about the people downtown.</p>
<p>I think my problem with agendas are, that they feel inconsistent with what the gospel really is.  When somebody has an agenda in a relationship, they are really only nice to you or want to be your friend because they want something from you, or want you to do something for them.  If we wanted to have everyone that lives downtown, attend theStory’s service on Sundays, and so we started integrating ourselves into the downtown core so we could start bringing people out to the service, then that would be an agenda.  That isn’t why we are there.  People showing up at our service really has very little to do what is going on.</p>
<p>However, as Christians, I think it is still crucial that we have a mission.  A mission is different than an agenda.  Agenda’s can be checked off as completed when the work is done or when I get what I want.  Mission is about a commitment to a way of life, something that you bring into whatever happens around you no matter how people respond, if they respond at all.  As Christians, we believe that the way we should live our lives is by loving God and loving others.  Part of our mission is to do that to the best ability wherever we are.  Since we are downtown, our mission is played out daily in our relationships with whoever we run into.  Agenda’s come with expectations for the other, mission comes with duty for yourself.  </p>
<p>There is a purpose I’m downtown but it isn’t to complete or follow an agenda.  I will not be able to wake up tomorrow morning either disappointed or excited because the agenda worked.  Mission doesn’t give such a clear picture of what the future looks like.  Rather, it gives you an arrow in which direction to head.  The other beautiful thing about mission is that it gives purpose that is based on what you should contribute rather than what you need to accomplish or how people must respond.  In other words, with mission you aren’t scored and ranked, where with an agenda, you almost get marked with how closely you followed it and how people react to you.</p>
<p>So after three years we are beginning to see what this looks like.  If we were following an agenda, we would have been disappointed long ago, since really no one from downtown is attending our Sunday services.  However, that was never our goal.  Our goal was to move into downtown, and love on downtown people.  End of story.  Whatever comes from that was awesome, but there will never be any expectation to exactly how that will play out, who will join us or what it will look like.  We are constantly accomplishing our mission every day, it will never full be accomplished and that’s what I like about mission.  It just gives you daily purpose for how you should live your life rather than mandating what everyone else has to do around you to fit into how you think things should be.</p>
<p>For this, I am grateful.  I think throwing out an agenda was a good thing for us.  It has allowed us to face into whatever came our way and not pre-determined exactly what we were going to look like.  We allow our mission to shape our day to day activities and how we interact and go from there.  I don’t feel stuck, and I do not feel like I have failed at anything because there is nothing to fail at.  I am here and I love people and I love God.  Mission being accomplished.</p>
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		<title>Shared to Be Real</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/17/shared-to-be-real</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/17/shared-to-be-real#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jun 2010 03:56:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Money and Finances]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[We spend quite a bit of time pursuing, collecting and naming all of our possessions. We work hard so we can buy more things. We take vacation so we can get a break from all those things. We play hard so we can use those things. We spend an unhealthy amount of time sorting, labeling, [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2007/06/09/when-sharing-gets-real' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: When Sharing Gets Real'>When Sharing Gets Real</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2009/12/03/funny-christian-videos-that-are-actually-for-real' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Funny Christian Videos That Are Actually For Real'>Funny Christian Videos That Are Actually For Real</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/08/05/god-as-found-in-lars-and-the-real-girl' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: God as Found in Lars and the Real Girl'>God as Found in Lars and the Real Girl</a></li>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We spend quite a bit of time pursuing, collecting and naming all of our possessions.  We work hard so we can buy more things.  We take vacation so we can get a break from all those things.  We play hard so we can use those things.  We spend an unhealthy amount of time sorting, labeling, cleaning, collecting, shopping, seeking and dreaming about our things.  Our entire lives are consumed by the next thing that we get or that we want.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m beginning to wonder if we started to think more like <a href="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/08/everything-belongs-to-everyone">this post I wrote a few months ago</a>, that we could start to have a different perspective on material possessions all together?</p>
<p>I think we have a major flaw in the way we look at the world.  We see everything in the world as something that we can own.  So over centuries we have mined and moved around and cut down and built things so that we could use the world for what we think it should be used for.  We see the world through one lens, and that lens is dominantly selfish one.  If everything, everywhere is meant to be owned and possessed by someone.  If that someone gets to choose the fate of whatever they own, strictly because they own it based on whatever laws in their society.  Then the world has become nothing more than a large shopping mall, that instead of cash, it&#8217;s first come, first served and people can take and do whatever they want.  Ownership and possession become key to the language we use when we talk about material possessions.</p>
<p>May I suggest an alternative?  What if instead seeing material things as something to be possessed and owned primarily we look at material things as something to be shared first?  What if as soon as you found yourself with the responsibility of any item, your first instinct was how do I share this rather than how do I guarantee my ownership of it?  This takes a completely different shift in the way that we look at everything, but I think it is possible.  </p>
<p>If we truly see the earth as God&#8217;s and everything in it, then it is unnecessary to see these things inside the world as ours at all.  We use ideas of stewardship and responsibility to help us spend what is ours more wisely but there is one flaw in this type of thinking.  It presupposes there is anything that is ours in the first place.  What if material possessions could only truly be experienced when shared, not when owned?  What if we can only truly experience what God has for us in this world through sharing and giving away?  I think that if we can move away from a type of thinking that tells us that to enjoy something we have to own it and use it up that we might be better off.  The best things in life only become a reality when they are shared with others or given away.  The kingdom works this way as well.  Why should it be any different with material things?</p>
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		<title>A Conversation On Salvation: Where Are My Flaws?</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/14/a-conversation-on-salvation-where-are-my-flaws</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/14/a-conversation-on-salvation-where-are-my-flaws#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 20:40:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2651</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The following is a conversation that happened on my Facebook Wall a few weeks ago.  Ralph is a worship pastor at the large Baptist church in Sarnia, and we tend to go back and forth quite a bit on theological conversations but never really land on any kind of common ground.  We both have our [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/03/30/salvation-here-and-now' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Salvation: Here and Now'>Salvation: Here and Now</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2007/08/15/what-i-don-t-believe-on-hell-salvation-a' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: What I Don&#8217;t Believe on Hell, Salvation and Death'>What I Don&#8217;t Believe on Hell, Salvation and Death</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/05/29/salvation-less-like-a-contract-more-like' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Salvation: Less Like a Contract; More Like Learning a Language'>Salvation: Less Like a Contract; More Like Learning a Language</a></li>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The following is a conversation that happened on my Facebook Wall a few weeks ago.  Ralph is a worship pastor at the large Baptist church in Sarnia, and we tend to go back and forth quite a bit on theological conversations but never really land on any kind of common ground.  We both have our own reasons I am sure that this is the case.  The conversation that I&#8217;ve posted in its entirety below has been referenced a number of times (positive and negative).  So if you have some time, read over this conversation, correct me and show me how I could have handled this better and/or where my theology needs working.</p>
<h3><a href="http://www.facebook.com/colquhoun">Nathan Colquhoun</a> All Roads Lead to  Heaven? <a onmousedown="UntrustedLink.bootstrap($(this), &quot;eb3da&quot;, event);" rel="nofollow" href="http://ff.im/-kmaGb" target="_blank">http://ff.im/-kmaGb</a></h3>
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<p><a title="Domenic Ruso" href="http://www.facebook.com/domruso"><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs641.snc3/27342_505095474_7652_q.jpg" alt="Domenic Ruso" /></a></p>
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<p><strong>Domenic  Ruso</strong><br />
Nathan, you might want to read Stephen  Prothero&#8217;s new book.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
looks good actually, you have a copy?</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
So is Jesus the only way to heaven? What do  you believe Nathan? It&#8217;s yes or no&#8230;is repentance and faith in Jesus  Christ the ONLY way to heaven?</p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
I think that&#8217;s a complicated  question for a few reasons.</p>
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<p>1. When you ask it, I think you are  really asking, &#8220;do you believe that the only way someone can spend  eternity in heaven (as opposed to eternity in hell) is to confess with  their mouth that they cognitively believe that jesus died and rose again  for their sins.&#8221;</p>
<p>So why don&#8217;t you reframe your question?</p>
<p>Cause I can answer &#8216;yes&#8217; to your  question, but I know we disagree, so I think the question is flawed.   For the record, I do hold that only Jesus makes it possible for all to  be redeemed one day, but that&#8217;s not really what you are asking me.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
It is not a flawed question whatsoever. It  is very straight-forward and simple. You are a pastor of a church. Is  eternal salvation received through Jesus Christ and Him alone or not?  Yes or no.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
I already did, i wrote &#8216;yes&#8217;  and I explained what I meant by it, its complicated and is not a yes or  no answer.</p>
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<p>But I still don&#8217;t think your question makes any sense,  because it is loaded with a whole slew of doctrine you are not  mentioning.</p>
<p>Your question begs a hundred other questions, for  instance, salvation from what?  is eternity forever?  is there another option if you don&#8217;t receive  said salvation?  what does &#8220;through&#8221; mean?  is it a prayer, a thought, a  word, an action?  I could keep going, but I think you get my drift,  it&#8217;s not a straight forward question, you presume and already have an  understanding of all my other questions, where anyone reading this does  not.</p>
<p>Do I believe Jesus died and rose again?  Yup.<br />
Do I  believe that through Jesus salvation is offered to all?  Yup.<br />
Do I  believe that if someone doesn&#8217;t understand cognitively understand what  the heck we are talking about they are going to an eternal hell with no  escape.  No.</p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
Biblical Christianity isn&#8217;t  complicated on this matter.</p>
<div id="text_expose_id_4c168e2330b424d9992e1">Acts 4:12 referring to Jesus, says,  &#8220;Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under  heaven given to men by which we must be saved.&#8221;<br />
John 14:6 Jesus  answered, &#8220;I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the  Father except through me.&#8221;<br />
Any question can &#8216;beg other questions.&#8217; I just wanted to know what  you believe. So you sort of said yes but then you said it&#8217;s not a yes or  no answer, and then you answered some other questions I didn&#8217;t ask  which still don&#8217;t give a definitive answer. So I will ask it one more  time. Is Jesus the ONLY way to eternal salvation? Is he the only way?  That is a one word answer&#8230;yes or no.</div>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
No Ralph, it&#8217;s not complicated  at all, that&#8217;s why we have schools, and hundreds of splits and  denominations, people who spend their entire lives studying and  questioning and seeking&#8230;.it&#8217;s that way because it&#8217;s simple.  It&#8217;s that  way because everyone says it&#8217;s so &#8220;simple&#8221; but it&#8217;s really not that  simple and I think we need more people who can admit that its complicated and be ok with  that.</p>
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<p>Since you brought up bible verses.  I&#8217;ll throw a bunch into  the mix to prove that it&#8217;s not that simple, in brackets I wrote what is  expected so that you either don&#8217;t go to hell or reap eternal life.</p>
<p>Matthew  7:21<br />
Not everyone who says to me, &#8216;Lord, Lord,&#8217; will enter the  kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in  heaven.<br />
(only those that do what he says)</p>
<p>John 3:5<br />
Jesus  answered, &#8220;I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God  unless he is born of water and the Spirit.<br />
(now you have to be  baptized to)</p>
<p>1 Corinthians 7:14<br />
For the unbelieving husband  has been sanctified through his wife, and the unbelieving wife has been  sanctified through her believing husband. Otherwise your children would  be unclean, but as it is, they are holy.<br />
(be married to someone who  believes)</p>
<p>James 2:14<br />
What good is it, my brothers, if a man  claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him?<br />
(Do  good deeds)</p>
<p>Matthew 25:45-46<br />
&#8220;He will reply, &#8216;I tell you the  truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did  not do for me.&#8217;<br />
&#8220;Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but  the righteous to eternal life.&#8221;<br />
(feed the poor)</p>
<p>So without  giving you a direct answer to your flawed question again, I ask you.</p>
<p>What  is eternal salvation?<br />
What does it meant to be the ONLY way?</p>
<p>Unless  you answer those questions, I&#8217;m afraid I can&#8217;t answer yours.</p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
Peter and John &#8216;were  unschooled, ordinary men&#8217;&#8230;as it says in Acts 4:13. I too never went to  bible college and certainly I wish there were no denominations and  splits and schisms. As for your verses let&#8217;s go;</p>
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<p>Matthew 7:21  refers to the will of the Father or as you said &#8216;do what he says.&#8217; God&#8217;s  plan of salvation (and therefore His will) is in the giving of his son Jesus so that we would have  eternal life (John 3:16). God has said through John 3:16 that it all  points directly to Jesus.</p>
<p>John 3:5 The word “water” mentioned in  this verse is not literal physical water but rather a reference to the  “living water” which only Jesus gives. Check out http://www.gotquestions.org/baptism-John-3-5.html for a full  description of the meaning of this verse). Conclusion &#8211; being born again  is through faith in Jesus Christ.</p>
<p>1 Corinthians 7:14 There is  absolutely nothing in this chapter that refers to eternal salvation.  This about marriage. Salvation is through Jesus Christ (Acts 4:12)</p>
<p>James  2:14 James is not saying here that justification is by faith plus  works, but rather that a person who is truly justified by faith will  have good works in his/her life. One is an outcome of the other&#8230;faith  in Jesus Christ produces lasting good works.</p>
<p>Matthew 25:45-46  First of all this is a parable. A parable is a short simple story from  which a moral or religious lesson may be drawn&#8230;but typically not what  you base doctrine on. This passage is similar to what James 2 says. The  parable starts off with the sheep already designated on the right and  the goats on the left. The core message of the parable of the sheep and  goats is that good works will result from our relationship to the  Shepherd, to Jesus Christ. True followers of Christ will produce good  works, will treat others with kindness, will deal with others as if they  were dealing with Christ. Those who reject Christ (goats on the left)  live in the opposite manner. While “goats” can indeed do acts of  kindness and charity, their hearts are not truly in them for the right  purpose – to honor and worship God through Jesus Christ and hence they  are cast out. The practical message of this parable iis, just where,  exactly, we stand in relation to the Shepherd (Jesus Christ). Are you a  Sheep or a Goat, saved or lost?<br />
So the verses you gave me all point  back to salvation through Jesus Christ and him alone.<br />
There&#8217;s no  such thing as a flawed question unless it contradicts itself.<br />
So  what is eternal salvation? A forever, endless, outside of time existance  and deliverance from the power and penalty of sin; redemption back to  God and living in his presence.</p>
<p>What does it meant to be the  ONLY way to God? Answer &#8211; through faith in Jesus Christ. Do you believe  that Nathan? Yes or no?</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
Ralph, you certainly have a lot  of interpretation going on there for each and every one of those  verses.  That seems a bit more than simple to me.  Where did you get all  that information?  I&#8217;m assuming from some source outside of the Bible.   I didn&#8217;t throw around those verses to try to say anything with them,  just to show you that throwing around verses doesn&#8217;t really prove anything.  Want  some more?</p>
<div id="text_expose_id_4c168e2338c995dcd5927">
<p>Mark 2:4<br />
When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the  paralytic, &#8220;Son, your sins are forgiven.<br />
(looks like the friends  faith gave forgiveness to his sins same in matt 9:1)</p>
<p>Luke 19:1-10<br />
story  of Zaccheus&#8211;chief tax collector of Jericho says he will give half of  his wealth to the poor and repay those he cheated 4 times the amount.   Jesus says TODAY salvation has come to your house.  What?  Just by  giving away stuff?</p>
<p>Matthew 10:22<br />
All men will hate you because  of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.<br />
(just stay  firm)</p>
<p>Mark 10<br />
just read that dialogue between Jesus and the  rich man, nothing about faith, but all through actions he had to do.</p>
<p>The  point of all these, is that people come to Jesus through lots of  different ways, through giving away their riches, through their friends,  through baptism, through confessing, through marriage, through  repentance&#8230;.</p>
<p>So again, for the record, I do believe that only  through Jesus is salvation found.  But just because their is only one  way to God, doesn&#8217;t mean there isn&#8217;t a lot of ways to Jesus.</p>
<p>Do I  believe that someone has to have cognitive faith in Jesus Christ to get  to God?  No.</p>
<p>I believe babies, mentally ill, confused sinners,  indoctrinated unbelievers and sexually immoral will one day be redeemed  fully from the power and penalty of sin through Jesus Christ.</p>
<p>Side  question, which you can answer later, are you serious about not basing  theology on a parable and only using it for a &#8220;moral lesson?&#8221;</p>
<p>I  think there is such thing as a flawed question if it fails to take into  account everything that it is asking.  I am asking for clarification on  the question, which we are beginning to do through this conversation.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
Yes or no Nathan! Final answer!</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
Again, I answer.  It depends.</p>
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<p>Let me  ask you a yes or no question.</p>
<p>Do you feel guilty when you beat  your wife?.</p>
<p>Yes or No, that&#8217;s all I want as an  answer to that question.</p>
<p>Some questions even though phrased like a  yes or no question, don&#8217;t merit a yes or no response.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
For the record, I&#8217;m obviously not accusing  you of such a thing.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
haha&#8230;that&#8217;s cool&#8230;</p>
<div id="text_expose_id_4c168e233c16373455e3e">Not  sure though that the question was the same type of question but at least  it helped me understand your perspective a bit.<br />
Good interpretation  of scripture is always necessary especially if one calls him/herself a  &#8216;critical thinker.&#8217; You mention alot of verses here and gave literal  interpretations for each while I know you don&#8217;t even agree with taking the bible  literally. To tell me that &#8216;throwing around verses doesn&#8217;t really prove  anything&#8217; is exactly my point. When I use scripture it is because I  believe it is God&#8217;s word and that it is profitable for doctrine, for  reproof, correction and training in righteousness.<br />
For you, scripture  is not your final belief. You have to have a &#8216;conversation&#8217; about it  with other people and then sort of decide what you want to believe for  the present at least. To a biblical Christian, my question was very  simple and easy to understand and not flawed. You are not a biblical  Christian and therefore you don&#8217;t get it. I&#8217;m not being arrogant or  accusing here&#8230;just stating the obvious.<br />
Gotta run&#8230;head for  church. We will talk about Jesus our redeemer and how he is the only way  to heaven&#8230;!</div>
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<div id="comment_1097135085_394527687719_13254049">
<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun</strong><br />
I wouldn&#8217;t go that far to call  me a non-biblical Christian just because you and I don&#8217;t agree on what  the Bible says.  We are still both using scripture here.  The reason I  say that you are throwing verses around is because you didn&#8217;t interpret  yours.  You didn&#8217;t say who was writing it, who it was being written to,  what was happening while it was being written&#8230;etc.  All you said is &#8220;this is  what the bible says.&#8221;  So I was just using scripture like you were.  If  I was actually trying to prove anything with it, then you would be  right.  So I fully agree with you that good interpretation is important  (because we&#8217;ve done a bad job of that in the past).  Not just  interpreting individual verses either, but interpretation the narrative  as a whole.  What is God up to through the entire scriptures and how  does this fit?  That is one of the main questions I always ask.</p>
<div id="text_expose_id_4c168e2340b224edd98d4">
<p>So  back to the original question.  Do I believe that through Jesus, that  is the only way to God and eternal salvation?</p>
<p>The reason I find  this complicated is because you are presuming we agree on your language  at all for me to answer this.</p>
<p>For instance, when you say  &#8220;through&#8221; I think we both think that our version of that word is  biblical.  When you say &#8216;through&#8217;, my guess is that comes with the whole  idea that one must decide that they believe this reality to be true for  them, and unless they do make this decision then there is no eternal  salvation for them.  And you would have good reason to believe this,  there is plenty of scripture that uses language such as &#8220;through faith  in&#8221; and &#8220;confess&#8221; and &#8220;believes.&#8221;</p>
<p>I on the other hand see that  whole transaction as being completely independent from whether or not an  individual chooses to believe it or not.  I believe that it is through  the death and resurrection that all men from all time are given access  to the eternal party, not just those that believe in Jesus.  I would  take my cues from scripture by looking at the entire story as a whole,  looking at how Paul explains redemption in colossians and romans.  I do  not make a distinction between those that are &#8220;saved&#8221; and those that are  &#8220;unsaved&#8221; rather my distinction comes from terms like those that decide  to work along side of the kingdom of God and those that choose not too.   Wherever they land on that spectrum really to me doesn&#8217;t have anything  to do with an eternal destiny.</p>
<p>So I feel like when I answer your  question, I then get pigeonholed into you thinking that I mean what you  are intending, when I don&#8217;t believe that at all.  This is why I am  hesitant.  I&#8217;m also hesitant because if I gave you a yes or no answer,  then it would end the conversation, and I for one enjoy them.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
Through: used as a function  word to indicate means, agency, or intermediacy; as a or by means of; by  the agency of; because of&#8230;</p>
<div id="text_expose_id_4c168e23416e258b32bfa">Biblical Christianity is a belief and  faith in salvation and eternal life THROUGH Jesus Christ.One  doesn&#8217;t need to go through an entire interpretation of a verse each time  it is used. We can used scripture verses that say what they mean within  a given context and this shouldn&#8217;t be construed as offensively throwing  verses around&#8230;</p>
<p>So, I did finally get an answer from you  when you said &#8216;when I don&#8217;t believe that at all.&#8217; And to say &#8220;I do not  make a distinction between those that are &#8220;saved&#8221; and those that are  &#8220;unsaved&#8221; simply means you are in total disagreement with the scriptures  and with the Apostles who wrote many, many times about being &#8216;saved.&#8217; I  won&#8217;t take the time to throw any verses at you but you can look &#8216;em  up&#8230;<br />
Thanks for the dialogue&#8230;</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v230/1888/123/q501472719_5844.jpg" alt="Nathan Colquhoun" /></p>
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<p><strong>Nathan  Colquhoun<br />
</strong>I don&#8217;t think I am in disagreement with the  scriptures as much as I am in disagreement with your interpretation of  them and you in disagreement with my interpretation of them.  But yes,  you did get an answer from me, so if you are cool with the dialogue  ending there, then I bid you peace.</p>
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<p><img src="http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/hs645.snc3/27428_507307331_9514_q.jpg" alt="Ralph Jarvis" /></p>
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<p><strong>Ralph Jarvis</strong><br />
Peace</p>
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		<title>Attacking Systems, Not People</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/07/attacking-systems-not-people</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/07/attacking-systems-not-people#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jun 2010 19:37:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2648</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am learning the art of attacking systems. I don&#8217;t want to just point them out and walk around with a sign that makes catchy insults about them. I don&#8217;t want to just blog about them. I want to shape my entire life that faces into corrupt empires and oppressive systems and refuses to back [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2009/03/26/safe-from-people-not-like-me' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Safe From People Not Like Me'>Safe From People Not Like Me</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2006/10/18/truth-or-people' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Truth or People?'>Truth or People?</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/01/20/pretty-people-make-it' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Pretty People Make It'>Pretty People Make It</a></li>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am learning the art of attacking systems.  I don&#8217;t want to just point them out and walk around with a sign that makes catchy insults about them.  I don&#8217;t want to just blog about them.  I want to shape my entire life that faces into corrupt empires and oppressive systems and refuses to back down to mediocrity and the thievery of free thought.</p>
<p>Instead of attacking systems, I used to attack people.  I would make fun of them and mock the stupid things they say.  I would say this was sort of the easy way to face into what I didn&#8217;t believe in and fight for what I did believe in.  When Mark Driscoll would say something stupid that would give some fuel to the fire to launch into an attack to finally announce what I believe.  I don&#8217;t think this is necessarily bad or wrong all the time, but it certainly does reduce the dialogue to mere insults and childish comebacks.  There is very little original thought and everything is reactionary.</p>
<p>Chris Hedges fascinates me away whenever I read <a href="http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/the_christian_fascists_are_growing_stronger_20100607/?ln" target="_blank">his articles</a>.  Direct and large attacks are taken at harmful and destructive systems that we all find ourselves caught in or observing.  There is something deeply profound about those that can use words to describe realities as opposed to just having opinions about them.</p>
<p>So I am learning to scale back on attacking individuals as if they are the sole problem everything is going wrong.  There is large systems at work that entangle us in their large reach.  To simply attack the individuals who have lost their ability to think for themselves and allow the systems to do the thinking for them only perpetuates an attack on unknowing civilians.</p>
<p>I have realized though that when you attack systems, you do get just as much flack.  People take offense when you attack systems that they find their identity in.  People, who have been unable to discover value in who they are find it in what they are told to believe.  So they get offended and launch attacks of their own.  Very rarely will it be an attack on your system, it will almost usually be an attack on your person.  Those that get offended easily by discussions and critiques on systemic realities tend to not be able to think abstractly about their lives.  So they speak the only language they know, and attack individuals and hurl insults and accusations.  They call people heretics, without having any reasons for what they believe themselves.</p>
<p>So it&#8217;s a fine balance to hold.  We should stand up strong and fight and live against systems that oppress and threaten freedom of thought.  Yet we should be loving and compassionate to all those that are tangled into the tight hold of these systems.  Hurling insults at them about being brainwashed and indoctrinated will not change systems, it will just make these people hurl insults back.  Then you have a dialogue about nothing.  When people attack you, don&#8217;t get offended and stoop to the level of individuality.  Attack their system without apology and in the same breath; love and spread compassion.</p>
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		<title>theStory Is On The Map For Sarnia First Fridays</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/01/thestory-is-on-the-map-for-sarnia-first-fridays</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/06/01/thestory-is-on-the-map-for-sarnia-first-fridays#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 20:31:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[theStory]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2640</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We&#8217;ve been trying to get on the map for First Friday&#8217;s for over a year now.  Since we&#8217;ve been downtown Sarnia, we&#8217;ve been wanting to participate and help out with everything that is going on.  The First Friday art walkabouts are one of the bigger things that happen down here.  So every month, stores stay [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/03/17/the-values-experiment-sarnia-first-friday-event' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: The Values Experiment: Sarnia First Friday Event'>The Values Experiment: Sarnia First Friday Event</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/10/27/new-thestory-website' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: New theStory Website'>New theStory Website</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2006/09/27/thestory-inside-the-city' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: theStory Inside the City'>theStory Inside the City</a></li>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;ve been trying to get on the map for First Friday&#8217;s for over a year now.  Since we&#8217;ve been downtown Sarnia, we&#8217;ve been wanting to participate and help out with everything that is going on.  The First Friday art walkabouts are one of the bigger things that happen down here.  So every month, stores stay open late and display art, installations and music.  We are now on the map and will be participating with the even every month.  Needless to say, we are excited!  Below is the map for the June First Friday.  We are having <a href="www.sharidoseger.com" target="_blank">Shari come down from Kingston</a> to display her art for our first night!</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/FirstFriday_June2010_1.jpg"><img class="aligncenter size-large wp-image-2641" title="FirstFriday_June2010_1" src="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/FirstFriday_June2010_1-662x1024.jpg" alt="" width="515" height="796" /></a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/FirstFriday_June2010_2.jpg"><img class="aligncenter size-large wp-image-2642" title="FirstFriday_June2010_2" src="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/FirstFriday_June2010_2-662x1024.jpg" alt="" width="515" height="796" /></a></p>
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		<title>Wear Their Face On Your Heart</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/30/wear-their-face-on-your-heart</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/30/wear-their-face-on-your-heart#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 04:40:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2634</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#8217;s good when people try their best to redeem our consistent need to have the best brands.  Brands drive me nuts.  So crazy that I have gone out of my way to not buy things that I see advertised and make sure I wear clothes with no visible label.  I got tired of paying to [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2006/04/28/some-clothing-i-wear' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Some Clothing I Wear'>Some Clothing I Wear</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/04/02/enouragement-does-the-heart-well' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Enouragement: Does the Heart Well'>Enouragement: Does the Heart Well</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/06/01/stats-to-cure-a-naive-heart' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Stats to Cure a Nave Heart'>Stats to Cure a Nave Heart</a></li>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s good when people try their best to redeem our consistent need to have the best brands.  Brands drive me nuts.  So crazy that I have gone out of my way to not buy things that I see advertised and make sure I wear clothes with no visible label.  I got tired of paying to advertise for someone else.</p>
<p>In response to this type of problem there is a t-shirt company called <a href="http://www.joytshirt.com/" target="_blank">Joy Apparel</a> and their mission is this:</p>
<blockquote><p>Every face on a Joy T- Shirt has  been inspired by a real person. When you wear your shirt you are  encouraged to think about that person and how your everyday actions can  affect others and the world we live in.</p></blockquote>
<p>What a great idea.  So Rachel and her friends all got their faces on shirts and wear eachother&#8217;s faces around day to day, and keeps them close to their heart.  <a href="http://www.joytshirt.com/rachel-colquhoun.php" target="_blank">Here is Rachel&#8217;s face</a>, you can buy it or pick from tons of others.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/rachel-joy-apparel1.png"><img class="aligncenter size-full wp-image-2636" title="rachel-joy-apparel" src="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/rachel-joy-apparel1.png" alt="" width="550" height="283" /></a></p>
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		<title>Pornography and Following Jesus</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/25/pornography-and-following-jesus</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/25/pornography-and-following-jesus#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 00:57:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Uncategorized]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2632</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have read quite a bit on pornography and &#8220;every man&#8217;s battle&#8221; with it over my time working with the church.  There is everything from Every Man&#8217;s Battle to youth curriculum for dealing with pornography, masturbation, adolescence and sex.  These are all good resources depending on where you are coming from and who you are.  [...]


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<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2006/08/23/consumerism-then-jesus' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Consumerism, then Jesus'>Consumerism, then Jesus</a></li>
</ol>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read quite a bit on pornography and &#8220;every man&#8217;s battle&#8221; with it over my time working with the church.  There is everything from Every Man&#8217;s Battle to youth curriculum for dealing with pornography, masturbation, adolescence and sex.  These are all good resources depending on where you are coming from and who you are.  I always thought though that the church generally handled this issue like all others.  Not nearly honestly enough.   Then <a href="http://xxxchurch.com/" target="_self">XXX Church</a> came out and really brought a breath of fresh air to the subject and reality that our culture was facing.  They made it easy to talk about, admit our human weaknesses and were especially not judgmental.  They weren&#8217;t just talking about it either, they were amidst the sin they were attempting to rid.  Most see this as not very productive, but I thought it was beautiful.</p>
<p>I just finished reading <a href="http://www.alternet.org/sex/146957/is_porn_bad_for_you?page=entire" target="_blank">Is Porn Bad for You?</a> by Wendy Maltz.  It was an excellent article about her journey through porn in seeing it as healthy to unhealthy.  I think it&#8217;s articles like this that anyone teaching or journeying with people on this subject should start with.  It is an honest article about why we look at porn, the role it may have in our relationships and how she eventually helps lead people away from it.   I love writing like this because it doesn&#8217;t instantly demonize the action or the people doing the action.  This is the approach that I think we as a church needs to take when dealing with everything that we deem as sin.</p>
<p>She wrote the article starting with her personal experience, explaining her academic experiences and findings, then her clinical ones and then slowly brought you with her as she explained why she came to the conclusion she did.  The issue in the end is about people, not about their problems.  How do we help people help themselves?  How do we better interact with people who have problems to help them instead of condemn them?  She ends the article like this.</p>
<blockquote><p>As therapists, perhaps our most important role is in   providing   clients a safe place to discuss and examine their concerns. It&#8217;s best     to analyze porn-related situations on a case-by-case basis, taking into     consideration a client&#8217;s personal values, sexual experience, sexual     orientation, and relationship status. I often rely on the following   questions   to help clients increase awareness and begin to evaluate   their involvement with   porn. <em>Is porn increasing or decreasing your   self-esteem and integrity? Is it   upsetting or alienating your   intimate partner (or harming your future chances   of being in a healthy   relationship)? Have you become preoccupied,   out-of-control,  dependent  on, or compulsively engaged with porn? How is porn   shaping  your  sexual thoughts, desires, and behaviors? What negative    consequences  could occur if you continue to use porn?</em> Only when  clients  determine they   want help quitting porn do we proceed in that   direction, utilizing the dynamic   strategies that exist for achieving   sexual recovery and healing. As mental   health professionals I believe   we&#8217;re most helpful when we resist our tendencies   to automatically   condemn or advocate porn. Our effectiveness depends on our   ability to   join with clients in regularly evaluating porn&#8217;s impact on their     lives. While I remain aware that porn use isn&#8217;t a problem for everyone, I   keep   in mind that, given its unprecedented power and accessibility,   it can become a   problem for anyone.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>Samuel Lukhele from Swaziland</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/21/samuel-lukhele-from-swaziland</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/21/samuel-lukhele-from-swaziland#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 May 2010 15:57:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[South Africa & Swaziland]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[South Africa Trip]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2627</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Rachel and I spent a few weeks in Swaziland a few years ago with the Lukhele family.  Samuel stole all of our hearts as soon as we met him.  I wrote about some of his quotes back when we were there.  He asked so many questions about the most ridiculous things because he was so [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/08/28/swaziland-day-11-13' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Swaziland &#8211; Day 11-13'>Swaziland &#8211; Day 11-13</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/08/26/africa-day-8-10' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Swaziland &#8211; Day 8-10'>Swaziland &#8211; Day 8-10</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/08/11/pictures-from-south-africa-and-swaziland' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Pictures from South Africa and Swaziland'>Pictures from South Africa and Swaziland</a></li>
</ol>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rachel and I spent a few weeks in Swaziland a few years ago with the Lukhele family.  Samuel stole all of our hearts as soon as we met him.  I <a href="http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2008/08/29/swaziland-day-14-15" target="_blank">wrote about some of his quotes</a> back when we were there.  He asked so many questions about the most ridiculous things because he was so curious about the world, and this was at his old age.  It was beautiful.  He knew how to care and he knew how to rest.  I just remember watching him sitting on his chair and enjoying life, I loved watching him so much I just couldn&#8217;t stop taking his picture.  At one point, as I was reaching my limits of physical exhaustion after five minutes of digging a hole he told me to stop because &#8220;there is no need to die today.&#8221;  Samuel&#8217;s physical body died this week.  May God be with your family and all those who will miss you from day to day.</p>
<p><a title="samuel 3 by nathancolquhoun, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nathancolquhoun/2856887423/"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3247/2856887423_d10c78cd27.jpg" alt="samuel 3" width="500" height="333" /></a></p>
<p><a title="samuel 1 by nathancolquhoun, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nathancolquhoun/2856893713/"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3215/2856893713_a41c80c242.jpg" alt="samuel 1" width="500" height="333" /></a></p>
<p><a title="samuel 2 by nathancolquhoun, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nathancolquhoun/2856898161/"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3160/2856898161_056b81b7a9.jpg" alt="samuel 2" width="500" height="333" /></a></p>
<p style="text-align: center;"><a title="samuel-2 by nathancolquhoun, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nathancolquhoun/2857813080/"><img class="aligncenter" src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3013/2857813080_3341286e71.jpg" alt="samuel-2" width="333" height="500" /></a></p>
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		<title>God&#8217;s on The Hook: A Sermon on God&#8217;s Speeches in the Book of Job</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/18/gods-on-the-hook-a-sermon-on-gods-speeches-in-the-book-of-job</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/18/gods-on-the-hook-a-sermon-on-gods-speeches-in-the-book-of-job#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 18 May 2010 19:50:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Sermons]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/?p=2624</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[We&#8217;ve spent two weeks now in the Book of Job.  We&#8217;ve spent some time with Job&#8217;s friends in the first week and took apart their accusations and why they would jump to such extravagant conclusions about Job&#8217;s life.  Then last week we spent some time with Job and asked questions like what does it mean [...]


Related posts:<ol><li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/02/09/bible-the-answer-book' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Bible: The Answer Book'>Bible: The Answer Book</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2005/02/03/bible-the-rule-book' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Bible: The Rule Book'>Bible: The Rule Book</a></li>
<li><a href='http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2006/06/06/webbers-book-on-the-younger-evangelicals' rel='bookmark' title='Permanent Link: Webber&#8217;s Book on the Younger Evangelicals (thoughts on revival and evangelism)'>Webber&#8217;s Book on the Younger Evangelicals (thoughts on revival and evangelism)</a></li>
</ol>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We&#8217;ve spent two weeks now in the Book of Job.  We&#8217;ve spent some time  with Job&#8217;s friends in the first week and took apart their accusations  and why they would jump to such extravagant conclusions about Job&#8217;s  life.  Then last week we spent some time with Job and asked questions  like what does it mean to suffer and why we can&#8217;t accept suffering as  real life and move on.  We always try and explain away our suffering as  to feel like we are in some type of control.  This week we are jumping  into God&#8217;s speeches.</p>
<p>God speaking is a pretty big deal.  Some  scholars are so amazed that God actually pipes up and speaks at all, so  much so that they barely pay attention to what he says.  They say that  just the very fact of him speaking satisfies the deepest desires of  Job.  We won&#8217;t stop there.  We will assume that because it is in there  that his actual words have something for us to understand.  God&#8217;s  speeches are split up into two different ones with a small part by Job  in the middle of the two.  The first speech emphasizes God&#8217;s plan and as  it evolves it gives meaning to all of God&#8217;s creative work and then  second speech shows of God&#8217;s justice in how he runs the world.  The  author of Job saves his best writing for God&#8217;s speeches.  This is  considered beautiful poetry in the Hebrew language.  In his two  speeches, God doesn&#8217;t even respond to Job&#8217;s questions.  He doesn&#8217;t bring  up his problems, or pity him, or acknowledge any of the brutal things  that has happened to him.  God opens up his speech with:</p>
<blockquote><p>Who is this that darkens my counsel<br />
with words  without knowledge?<br />
Brace  yourself like a man;<br />
I will question you,<br />
and you  shall answer me.</p></blockquote>
<p>God instantly accuses Job of having no  knowledge and starts right in on the offensive.  God doesn&#8217;t respond to  anything that Job asks.  Not a single thing.  So much for the idea of  prayer or speaking to God, right?  We think that praying or begging God  for an answer works, but we might not get anything in terms of what we  are actually asking.  We might just get God showing up.  Are we happy  with that?  Is Job happy with that?  When we pray, when we are suffering  and we beg of God for answers, we beg that God tells us what is going  on and especially why things are happening, are we ok when he changes  the subject?  In this case, God gives no answer of sort.  The only thing  remotes helpful is he actually shows up.  Sometimes this just isn&#8217;t  good enough for us.  We don&#8217;t want God to just show up.  We want  answers.  As if God knew what we were thinking.  He dives right into his  assault:</p>
<blockquote><p>Where were you when I laid the earth&#8217;s foundation?<br />
Tell me, if  you understand.</p>
<p>Who marked  off its dimensions? Surely you know!<br />
Who stretched a  measuring line across it?</p>
<p>On  what were its footings set,<br />
or who laid its cornerstone-</p>
<p>while the morning stars sang together<br />
and all the angels shouted for joy?</p>
<p>Who shut up the sea behind doors<br />
when it burst forth  from the womb,</p>
<p>when I made the  clouds its garment<br />
and wrapped it in thick darkness,</p>
<p>when I fixed limits for it<br />
and set its doors and bars in place,</p>
<p>when I said, &#8216;This far you may come and no farther;<br />
here is where your proud waves halt&#8217;?</p></blockquote>
<p>God, or Yahweh, starts  going through the initial stages of creation giving us different  pictures of what that would look like.  He starts to show Job through  his questions that his troubles mean nothing in terms of the brilliant  governance and creation of the world that he is in.  See Job doubted  God.  He doubted that God was consistent in managing the world in  righteousness.  So God asks him if he really knows what he is talking  about.    He asks him as if Job was there at the beginning.  He reminds  Job that his plan has its origin in the gratuitousness of creative  love.  However, from the Hebrew Bible perspective, wisdom was God&#8217;s sole  companion at the creation of the world.  So Job lacks useful knowledge  of anything that God is talking about.  So he can&#8217;t really answer God at  all.  God is full of beautiful imagery of how the world was created and  how he keeps sustaining it.</p>
<p>Not only did God plan everything,  the world, the skies, the water. He also made sure that everything was  created and held into place according to that plan.  It certainly wasn&#8217;t  Job that did all that.  Did Job even help with laying the cornerstone?   Did he cut the opening ceremonies ribbon?  Since no human was there,  humankind as a whole is left in the dark about how the universe really  works and was created.  Job is in no place to answer any of these  questions by God.  So we have Job who has just suffered the most  extraordinary of bad circumstances and then God finally shows up on  scene, tells Job to give it his best shot, and using hyperbole launches  into a full out show-off attack.  Here is God, who didn&#8217;t seem to have  any problems with volunteering Job for the worst of circumstances and  now he just wants to make a point about how great he is?</p>
<p><strong>How do  you feel about God&#8217;s response so far?  Is it cold and callous or does it  speak to God&#8217;s bigness and supreme reign over humanity?</strong></p>
<p>David  Bazan thinks it is cold and callous, in his song &#8220;In Stitches&#8221; his  final verse is:</p>
<blockquote><p>When Job asked you the  question<br />
You  responded who are you<br />
To challenge your creator<br />
Well if that one part is true<br />
It makes you sound  defensive<br />
Like you had not thought it through<br />
Enough to have an  answer<br />
Or  you might have bit off more than you could chew.</p></blockquote>
<p>I think  that what was going on here isn&#8217;t so much God showing off without any  care for Job or what he&#8217;s going for.  I also don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s simply God  changing the subject completely ignoring what&#8217;s happening telling him  to suck it up.  I don&#8217;t think Bazan is right in calling God defensive  either.  What I think is going on here is God is setting people in their  place.  He comes onto the scene after over 30 chapters of whining,  accusations, complaining, questioning God&#8217;s wisdom and character and  depression.  He just wants to set the record straight that none of them  really have any clue what they are talking about.  The very fact that  God comes in and speaks tells me that no one is really doing a good job  in speaking on behalf of him at all. Job hadn&#8217;t sinned, and God  was confirming that by not even once bringing anything up.  At the very  least, Job hadn&#8217;t sinned nearly enough to elicit a response from God  about it directly.  Job&#8217;s friends obviously didn&#8217;t get it either,  because God doesn&#8217;t even acknowledge their existence at all yet.  The  text says that God answered Job, no one else.</p>
<p>God is responding  to this deep sense of selfishness and self-entitlement that Job and his  friends all seem to have.  Job and his friends had this idea that the  world was created for them and no one else.  If you have this belief,  then you believe that everything around you is for your immediate use.   They thought that they knew the reason it was created and if they knew  the reason then they assume they know the specific path it is supposed  to take.  The problem lies with the fact that they did not understand  how it all started, like they thought they did.  If they don&#8217;t know how  and why it is all there, then they certainly have no idea what the path  it is going to take will be.</p>
<p>Like we talked about in the first  week.  They thought creation existed for them.  Since they thought they  knew how it started they assumed that they way it worked was according  to retribution theology, good things happen to good people, bad things  happen to bad people.  God steps up and criticizes that entire way of  thinking.  He says look, you have no idea how this all started, so you  certainly don&#8217;t know how it&#8217;s going to end and you absolutely don&#8217;t know  all the steps in between.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;What God is  criticizing here is every theology that presumes to pigeonhole the  divine action in history and gives the illusory impression of knowing it  in advance.&#8221;<br />
- Gustavo Gutierrez</p></blockquote>
<p>This book, we can  pressume from how God answers, is not a lesson in how to suffer and come  out on top.  This isn&#8217;t facing into the problem of evil in the world.   For all the messages we&#8217;ve heard how Job is a book about the problem of  evil, the problem of suffering, or why do bad things happen to good  people I don&#8217;t know if they have done us much good in helping us  understand what God is saying.  Here we are at the end of the book, God  has spoken and he hasn&#8217;t dealt with any of these issues at all.  Instead  he faces right into the idea that we can know anything at all about the  ways that God works.  We don&#8217;t, so stop pretending.  We cannot lay  hands on God and try to fit him into our narrow way of thinking.  We  cannot imprison him into our ignorant theological concepts.  He asks, do  we really want to make ourselves the judge of his actions?  In that  kind of universe, where the creation can limit and constrain God&#8217;s  action, God would not be God.  This is how they saw absolutely  everything, everything had an answer, everything was reduced to cause  and effect.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;The revelation of God&#8217;s plan,  when received with good judgment, will show Job that the doctrine of  retribution is not the key to understanding the universe; this doctrine  can give rise only to a commonplace relationship of self interest with  God and others.  The reason for believing &#8220;for nothing&#8221; &#8212; the theme set  at the beginning of the book&#8211;is the free and gratuitous initiative  taken by divine love.&#8221;<br />
- Gustavo Gutierrez</p></blockquote>
<p>For nothing.  This is  the part of this quote we need to take apart for a little bit.  This is  what God seems to be saying in his speeches.  So no matter what  questions Job and his friends asked.  They didn&#8217;t get answers.  They  were told instead that the world does not turn and move on their  questions and it does not behave the way that they expected.  Instead,  the world was created because God loves it, and God loves us.  That is  the purpose of the entire creation.  God created it because he loves it  and finds pleasure in it.  He doesn&#8217;t create it to enact retribution  laws throughout it.  The world is not about laws and having to work and  move in a certain way.  Can you even fathom a world where things happen  in it and you aren&#8217;t there?  God can.</p>
<blockquote><p>Who  cuts a channel for the torrents of rain,<br />
and a path for the  thunderstorm,</p>
<p>to water a land  where no man lives,<br />
a desert with no one in it,</p>
<p>to satisfy a desolate wasteland<br />
and make it sprout with grass?</p></blockquote>
<p>In ancient culture, rain was  directly related to being cursed or being blessed.  If you got rain you  were being blessed.  If you didn&#8217;t you were getting cursed.  However,  God is stomping all over this way of thinking.  The world doesn&#8217;t work  that way.  To prove it he says why in the world would it rain where  there is no one?  Why?  Cause God loves it.  God wants it to.  It has  nothing to do with you.  You aren&#8217;t even in the picture.  How selfish  you are to think that it only rains just to bless you.  It&#8217;s raining  everywhere, all the time, and for no reason at that.  The world doesn&#8217;t  revolve around humanity and what it&#8217;s needs are.  The world revolves  around God&#8217;s never-ending, forever gracious love.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Not everything that exists was made to be directly  useful to human beings; therefore, they may not judge everything from  their point of view.  The world of nature expresses the freedom and  delight of God in creating.  It refuses to be limited to the narrow  confines of the cause-effect relationship.&#8221;<br />
- Gustavo Gutierrez</p></blockquote>
<p>God  starts listing example after example of things that have nothing to do  with humans.  He gives examples of things that make no sense at all.</p>
<blockquote><p>The wings of the ostrich flap joyfully,<br />
but they  cannot compare with the pinions and feathers of the stork.</p>
<p>She lays her eggs on the ground<br />
and lets them warm in the sand,</p>
<p>unmindful that a foot may crush them,<br />
that some wild animal  may trample them.</p>
<p>She treats her  young harshly, as if they were not hers;<br />
she cares not that  her labor was in vain,</p>
<p>for God  did not endow her with wisdom<br />
or give her a share of good  sense.</p>
<p>Yet when she spreads her feathers  to run,<br />
she laughs at horse and rider.</p></blockquote>
<p>He spends a bunch of  verses here expounding on the stupidity of an ostrich.  The ostrich  makes no sense.  God says it doesn&#8217;t have to.  He made it and he loves  it and the ostrich loves it.  What else could you ask for.  Stop needing  to make sense of everything.  God expresses full delight in the world  because he made it.  It rains on no one and it rains on nothing; it  doesn&#8217;t need necessity because it just pleases God.  Utility is not the  primary reason for God&#8217;s action.  It doesn&#8217;t need to make any practical  sense.  Yet we seem to try to fit all God&#8217;s actions into our theological  constructs and refuse to seek him outside of them.  We want answers to  our questions.  Why is their evil?  Why am I suffering?  Why did she  turn into this?  Why did this happen?  We don&#8217;t think outside of that.   We think that because evil exists, there must be a reason for it, and  that we must know what it is.  Our theology tells us that God is good,  and if that is true, our theology also tells us that there are good  reasons for all these things that have happened.  They don&#8217;t exist so we  make them up.  We say that God must be teaching us a lesson.  Or God is  trying to strengthen us for the next hardship.  Or God is building up  our character to be a better person.  We have so many reasons as to why  everything happens.  One thing we are unwilling to do, at any time  though for some reason is to make the obvious observation that God just  straight up caused all this grief for no reason.</p>
<p>Think about it.  Let&#8217;s just read this part of the story  together.</p>
<blockquote><p>Then the LORD said  to Satan, &#8220;Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth  like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns  evil.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Does Job fear God for  nothing?&#8221; Satan replied.  &#8220;Have you not put a hedge around him and his  household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands,  so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land.  But  stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely  curse you to your face.&#8221;</p>
<p>The LORD said to  Satan, &#8220;Very well, then, everything he has is in your hands, but on the  man himself do not lay a finger.&#8221;</p>
<p>Then Satan went out from the presence  of the LORD.</p></blockquote>
<p>God totally sets up on Job,  and it doesn&#8217;t even look like he has a reason.  Then to top it all off,  after Satan goes out and kills everyone the story happens all over again  and this time Satan gets to attach his body.  Thanks God.  After all  this, you don&#8217;t even have the decency to give some explanation why you  did these things.</p>
<p><strong>Why did God allow this?  Is God directly responsible for the  evil in Job&#8217;s life?</strong></p>
<p>If he is responsible, we  want to give him a reason.  If he&#8217;s not responsible we have to explain  why he is not.  It seems to me that God doesn&#8217;t want off the hook for  the evil.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;The point is this: if God seems to be in  no hurry to make the problem of evil go away, maybe we shouldn&#8217;t be,  either.  Maybe our compulsion to wash God&#8217;s hands for him is a service  he doesn&#8217;t appreciate.  Maybe&#8211;all theodicies and nearly all theologians  to the contrary&#8211;evil is where we meet God.  Maybe he isn&#8217;t bothered by  showing up dirty for his dates with creation.  Maybe&#8211;just maybe &#8211;if  we ever solved the problem, we&#8217;d have talked ourselves out of a  lover&#8230;.God neither apologizes nor explains, and he certainly makes no  effort to solve the problem of evil for them.  He just goes on arranging  rendezvous after disreputable rendezvous, no matter how little anyone  thing of his choice of trysting places.&#8221;<br />
- Robert Capon</p></blockquote>
<p>Are we ok with  allowing God to be the source and the reason for evil like in this story  without trying to make it something else? Should  Job have been OK with everything that has happened?  I don&#8217;t think he  had to be OK with it, but eventually, to be part of this world, we need  to learn what it means to give up ourselves to something else.  To be in  a relationship with a creator that we can&#8217;t understand, sometimes we  have to give up on what we think we know, or what we want to know.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;And what is love if it is not the  indulgence of the ultimate risk of giving one&#8217;s self to another over  whom we have no control?&#8221;<br />
-  Robert Capon</p></blockquote>
<p>God is really not  interested in cleaning up our stories.  He seems ok with it all being put back on his  plate.  He seems like he wants to take the blame.  This isn&#8217;t really  something that we should avoid.  We need to give it to him and let it  rest on his plate.  The problem of every evil thing that happens in the  world isn&#8217;t our fault.  So back to God&#8217;s response.  What he does want us  to know, is that he is interested in being in love with his creation.   He created it.  He holds it all together.  He wants Job to know that he  is in absolute love and is completely pleased with everything he is done  including creating Job.  He is not regretting his decisions.  This  makes it difficult for us.  This means that we are kind of stuck in this  weird paradox of wanting and crying out  for justice and wanting what is right and  knowing that God also wants justice and wants what is right and in the  same breath realizing that God is seemingly doing nothing about it.</p>
<p>Eventually we will see.  If God  tells enough stories, maybe then we will realize that he doesn&#8217;t work  even remotely like we imagined or thought.  The entire story of the  Bible is completely opposite to where we would like to land.  Capon  tries to explain it a bit using 1 and 2 Kings.</p>
<p>If you look at  the author of 1 and 2 Kings, we an see that there was a theologian at  work here trying to make a statement.  He didn&#8217;t just want to tell you  what happened, but he had a theological understanding that the reason  the history of God&#8217;s people went so badly was because their kings  constantly broke and transgressed the law.  The theory of the author  worked for quite a while.  You start with Eli the priest and his  disobedient sons, which then the Philistines defeated the people of  Israel.  Next, God sent Samuel to clean things up but the people pushed  their way into needing a King.  Neither God or Samuel wanted that to  happen but let it happen anyway.  They get a King, and Saul disobeyed.   David on the other hand did pretty good, but then gave it to Solomon who  royally screwed it up which eventually lead to the kingdom falling  apart.</p>
<p>So the kingdom is split and both the northern and  southern kingdoms are failing to listen to the law whatsoever.  Every  king that he lists did exactly what they were not supposed to do, none  of them were good.  So the author thinks, that if there was only one  King that would come along and really keep the law, and do it well, then  everything bad would stop happening and everything would be honky  dory.  So finally, King Josiah, King of Judah steps into the mix.  He  keeps every law that was ever made.  He purifies the temple and keeps  the passover and kids out all the idols, laws that weren&#8217;t kept since  before any king existed.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Before him there was no king like him,  who turned to the Lord with all his heart, with all his soul, and with  all his might&#8230;.nor did any like him arise after him.&#8221;<br />
2 Kings 23:25</p></blockquote>
<p>Then  guess how the story ends?  Josiah dies in battle, slain by Pharaoh Neco  of Egypt, who also takes over Jerusalem.  Then he gets taken over by  Nebuchadnezzar, king of Babylon who then leads Israel into their time of  exile.  Even the authors of the bible can&#8217;t wrap their heads around  what is happening.  They are convinced God works one way.  Even when he  doesn&#8217;t.  The author of Kings is at a lost, he hits a block in his  writing for a little bit and then chooses to ignore it and goes right on  writing again as if all it would take is a king to obey the law.  He&#8217;s  desperately trying to make sense as to why in the world Israel would  constantly find themselves getting destroyed, so he makes up a reason.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Christian theologians who address  themselves to the problem of evil should treat it as a mystery to be  entered, not as a puzzle to be solved.&#8221;<br />
-Robert Capon</p></blockquote>
<p>We come to the same conclusion as a few  weeks ago.  Instead of trying to answer and explain away everything that  happens we need to be humbled.  This means that instead of trying to  seek all the things that God does, why don&#8217;t we just seek God.  Job&#8217;s  friends are determined to lay hands on God, instead of abandoning  themselves to God&#8217;s embrace and God&#8217;s inconceivable way of doing things.</p>
<p>Jesus  has a similar situation in Mark, where he seems to respond the same way  as God does here.</p>
<blockquote><p>Then James and John, the sons of Zebedee, came to him.  &#8220;Teacher,&#8221; they said, &#8220;we want you to do for us whatever we ask.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;What do you want me to do for you?&#8221; he  asked.</p>
<p>They replied, &#8220;Let one of  us sit at your right and the other at your left in your glory.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;You don&#8217;t know what you are asking,&#8221;  Jesus said. &#8220;Can you drink the cup I drink or be baptized with the  baptism I am baptized with?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;We  can,&#8221; they answered. Jesus said to them, &#8220;You will drink the cup I drink  and be baptized with the baptism I am baptized with, but to sit at my  right or left is not for me to grant. These places belong to those for  whom they have been prepared.&#8221;</p>
<p>Mark 10</p></blockquote>
<p>James and John are even a little more  forthright than Job&#8217;s friends are.  They just say straight up: do  whatever we want.  Jesus takes the same response as God.  Who do you  think you are?  Do you even know what your asking?  Can you do what I&#8217;m  doing?  Can you handle what I&#8217;m going to handle?  Then he goes off into a  rant about being great and becoming a servant.</p>
<p>James  and John are making the same mistake.  They think they are the center  of the universe.  They think that nothing else matters but them.  In  Job, God speaks of all the wonders of creation and nature and makes the  gap larger than Job could comprehend.  They are different.  Job has no  idea what is going on whatsoever.  In Mark, Jesus makes the gap just as  large and I don&#8217;t really think James and John know what they are talking  about.  They can&#8217;t do what he is doing or going to do.</p>
<p>What  I love about both these passages is that neither Jesus nor God punishes  or gets angry at Job, James or John for their questions.  The questions  are allowed.  The lamenting is allowed.  They are allowed to be in  their ignorance.  Job finds some type of freedom in his complaints and  rebellion.  God doesn&#8217;t correct him, he simply puts him in his place.</p>
<blockquote><p>You  and I are indeed free to cry out, to lament, to scream—if need be. The  God to whom we call does not ignore his dearly beloved creature. It is  just that God refuses to be confined within to a system of predictable  rewards and punishments. Jesus reminds us that “he makes his sun rise on  the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the righteous and on the  unrighteous.” (Mt 5: 45)<br />
-  Gustavo Gutierrez</p></blockquote>
<p>It is difficult, but we must resist simply  becoming like Job&#8217;s friends and creating reasons that don&#8217;t exist and  trying to put God into our box of explanations.  Remember that Job never  finds out why he is suffering.  God never gives him an answer.  God is  completely uninterested in why and it seems to be that he has no  interest on whether or not we care about why either.  He doesn&#8217;t answer  why but he does reassure that Job is not simply a prisoner of  retribution theology or karma.  He reassures him, and puts Job&#8217;s friends  into place, by reminding them that God doesn&#8217;t work in the ways we want  him to.</p>
<p>God wants to move us to a place of admiration.  The best  people that can teach theology are not those that try to argue for the  faith or explain away every single detail of some systemic rant.  The  best theologians just display what they know.  Remember the blind guy in  John 9?  I don&#8217;t know any of the answers to the questions you are  asking me.  But I do know this.  I once was blind, but now I see.  Look  at God&#8217;s answers.  I am not going to give you any answers to the  questions you are asking me but look at the waterfalls, and the animals  and the seas and the beautiful creation which I keep in tact every day  all day long.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nakedpastor.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/people-or-ideas.jpg" target="_blank"><img title="people or ideas" src="http://www.nakedpastor.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/people-or-ideas-1024x972.jpg" alt="" width="400" height="379" /></a></p>
<p>(ht <a href="http://www.nakedpastor.com/archives/5269" target="_blank">naked pastor</a>)</p>
<p>We  need to move from explanation to appreciation.  Admiration will truly  set us free.  God knew this.  So he sets up the stage and performs and  reminds Job of all the wonders of nature, which God created.  I can only  show you this paradox that leaves you upset and wanting more.  I cannot  give you anymore thing more than that.  This is what God leaves us with  when we are presented with the problem of evil.  His wonderful and  awe-inspiring image of creation and everything his hand can do, that  ours can&#8217;t.  This isn&#8217;t to stop us from asking questions, this is to  remind us that all the questions and answers we are dying for might not  be as necessary to right now as we think.  We don&#8217;t stop asking  questions, we just need to remember that we are no longer prisoner to  the answers.</p>
<p>So when people are dying to know where you  stand on the subject of secular music, or birth control, or abortion, or  homosexuality.  You can exit that situation with having to worry about  what the right answer or Christian answer is.  Your truths don&#8217;t rest in  systemic theology of right and wrong answers.  Instead your truths are  proclamations that once you were blind but now you see.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;We  arrive in our several pulpits not as the bearers of proof but as the  latest runners in a long relay race; not as savants with arguments to  take away the doubts of the faithful but as breathless messengers.&#8221;<br />
- Robert Capon</p></blockquote>
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		<title>The Church as Sacrament by Robert Capon</title>
		<link>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/14/the-church-as-sacrament-by-robert-capon</link>
		<comments>http://www.nathancolquhoun.com/2010/05/14/the-church-as-sacrament-by-robert-capon#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 May 2010 23:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Nathan Colquhoun</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[There is a good chance that I have fallen in love with someone that is not my wife.  His name is Robert Capon.  I just can&#8217;t get enough of his writing style, content, beauty and wit.  This is taken from The Third Peacock. &#8220;The church has always had a problem of explaining its relationship to [...]


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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a good chance that I have fallen in love with someone that is not my wife.  His name is Robert Capon.  I just can&#8217;t get enough of his writing style, content, beauty and wit.  This is taken from <a href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/0866834974?tag=httpwwwnathan-20&amp;camp=0&amp;creative=0&amp;linkCode=as1&amp;creativeASIN=0866834974&amp;adid=0WMS6PHZ35DB3PJ9WAXK&amp;" target="_blank">The Third Peacock</a>.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;The church has always had a problem of explaining its relationship to the world.  By far the commonest view is the Noah&#8217;s Ark theory: The human race is out there bobbing around in the drink.  Nobody can touch bottom; they all just tread water till they drown.  Up over the horizon sails the Ark of Salvation.  Much bustle.  Cries of &#8220;Man overboard!&#8221; and &#8220;Heave to!&#8221;  Apostles, Martyrs, Popes, Confessors, Bishops, Virgins and Widows lean over the sides with baptismal boat-hooks and haul the willing ones up over the gunwales.  Assorted purblind types, however, refuse to come aboard.  Sensible arguments are offered to them, but there are no takers.  After a just interval, the Captain orders full speed ahead and, swamping the finally impenitent in his wake, heads the church for the ultimate snug harbor.</p>
<p>The trouble with that view, and with many another more refined, is that it forces you to limit the Incarnate Word&#8217;s saving activity to the church.  No doubt the church is the only place where you can be sure (by means of easily recognized sacramental hats) that you have a firm grip on what he&#8217;s doing; but it doesn&#8217;t seem right to imply that he isn&#8217;t doing the same work everywhere else.  I, if I be lifted up, says Jesus, will draw <em>all</em> unto me.  God invented the ecumenical movement&#8211;and his version of it is not limited to Christians.  The relationship between the baptized and the unbaptized is not a case of us versus them.  The church is like the rest of the sacraments, an effective sign &#8212; a notable outcropping &#8212; of what all people already are by the Word&#8217;s work of creation and Incarnation.  The church is the mystical body because humanity is the mystical body.  The only difference is that in church the Mystery wears a hat on its head.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>This is in reference to when he says that sacraments are hats on  invisible men.  I am going to make a prediction.  I am going to say that it is only a matter of time before Robert Capon&#8217;s books and writings blow up and become one of those top sellers, where he needs to die before anyone cares or talks about what he is saying.  He hasn&#8217;t passed away yet, but he is getting pretty old and its unfortunate that he was listened to so little.  It will come.  His voice is needed.</p>
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